National Gun Forum banner
1 - 17 of 17 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
541 Posts
There has been a big influx from Africa, can't remember the name of the importer, maybe Tiger Imports? That rifle is in tough shape.

The Carcano is much maligned, But don't forget that a former Marine used one to great effect in Dallas 57 years ago...

The key issue is that while a nominal 6.5 diameter (6.5x52) the actual groove diameter can range from .265" to . 271" and bore diameter (at lands) from .257" to .263" and beyond . It is in fact a 6.7mm cartridge. Since all 6.5mm bullets are a nominal .264" , this, in large part accounts for its not entirely correct reputation for inaccuracy.

The 1891 Carcano was very advanced for its day, both in magazine design and use of the 6.5 (nominal) caliber. The 6.5x52 cartridge is very similar to the 6.5x54 Mannlicher Schoenauer, with which Karamojo Bell killed a number of elephants. But in 1891 at the dawn of the smokeless era, this short, light infantry rifle with its loooong 160 grs round nose cupronickle jacket was very advanced. It was then not really advanced much farther for 50 years.

Parts are generally available and the rifle is not particularly fragile but date of manufacture is important. Heat treating in the 1890s and first decade of the 20th Century was iffy.

The bore wants slugging. Finding out what the lands and grooves are at is the second order of business after an aggressive cleaning with JB Compound. If he's lucky and it's tight, .264" jacketed bullets might work. It's unlikely . So, then, it's a case of looking for a cast bullet that will fit or size to fit. Worst case it's a custom mould. Then, it's relatively soft lead, ie BHN 12 over about 17-18 grs of IMR 4227.

NB: if the rifle is of later manufacture, somebody like PPU might load 6.5 Carcano ammo
 

· Premium Member
Joined
·
9,926 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks for the info. He was also trying to nail down the date of manufacture. Know that some were longer guns cut down to carbine length. He paid $170. for it.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
6,726 Posts
do not know much....the battle rifle/carbine of Italy and the JFK lore....which still has its own debate...
use to be inexpensive surplus that disappeared.

from my understanding over the years, ammo is hard to find and the en bloc clips are harder to find. A box of ammo and some replacement en bloc clips some time back probably cost more than the surplus rifle did.
 

· AZHerper
Joined
·
6,333 Posts
There has been a big influx from Africa, can't remember the name of the importer, maybe Tiger Imports? That rifle is in tough shape.

The Carcano is much maligned, But don't forget that a former Marine used one to great effect in Dallas 57 years ago...

The key issue is that while a nominal 6.5 diameter (6.5x52) the actual groove diameter can range from .265" to . 271" and bore diameter (at lands) from .257" to .263" and beyond . It is in fact a 6.7mm cartridge. Since all 6.5mm bullets are a nominal .264" , this, in large part accounts for its not entirely correct reputation for inaccuracy.

The 1891 Carcano was very advanced for its day, both in magazine design and use of the 6.5 (nominal) caliber. The 6.5x52 cartridge is very similar to the 6.5x54 Mannlicher Schoenauer, with which Karamojo Bell killed a number of elephants. But in 1891 at the dawn of the smokeless era, this short, light infantry rifle with its loooong 160 grs round nose cupronickle jacket was very advanced. It was then not really advanced much farther for 50 years.

Parts are generally available and the rifle is not particularly fragile but date of manufacture is important. Heat treating in the 1890s and first decade of the 20th Century was iffy.

The bore wants slugging. Finding out what the lands and grooves are at is the second order of business after an aggressive cleaning with JB Compound. If he's lucky and it's tight, .264" jacketed bullets might work. It's unlikely . So, then, it's a case of looking for a cast bullet that will fit or size to fit. Worst case it's a custom mould. Then, it's relatively soft lead, ie BHN 12 over about 17-18 grs of IMR 4227.

NB: if the rifle is of later manufacture, somebody like PPU might load 6.5 Carcano ammo
Interesting that you mention Karamojo Bell (W. D. M. Bell). He was a fascinating character. Decorated fighter pilot, sailor, writer, painter, and one of the most successful African big game hunters of all time. An advocate of shot placement with small-bore rifles his favorite was his .275 Rigby (7x57mm) with which he killed about 800 elephants however he used several small caliber European rifles like the Carcano. At the time, most elephant hunters were using big bore rifles like the .500 and .600 Nitro Expresses.
 

· Ancient Gaseous Emanation
Joined
·
57,893 Posts
A video and some links for your perusal.


[video]






 

· Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Many years ago I did casual research on the Kennedy shooting. I recall various forensic evidence regarding Oswald's rifle revealed from deep sources. The scoped M91 Carcano rifle that was found in the Book Depository "sniper's nest" was a caliber 6.5X52mm. Several investigators stated that the scope was wobbly and the reticles were misaligned. However those statements never made it into the media and the Warren Report. The 6.5 Carcano had a reputation of severe inaccuracy. This info supports the testimony of many experts that Oswald made an "impossible" shot from that distance on moving target. Ballistics determined, or so stated, that the bullet was from a box of Carcano rounds taken from Oswald's garage. Another Carcano, the Model 38 in caliber 7.35X51mm is, however, described by experts as extremely accurate. Several investigators interviewed over the years following the "official" release of the Warren Report, have stated that the shot was made by a 7.35x51 Carcano. This is still the current thinking due to interviews with retired CIA and aged Mafia members. This post could continue but is limited to Carcano discussion only because of the initial poster's question. I once owned both of these Carcano models at the same time. The quality difference was unmistakable. I regret never shooting them. Ammo was just too hard to locate for me at the time.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
203 Posts
Many years ago I did casual research on the Kennedy shooting. I recall various forensic evidence regarding Oswald's rifle revealed from deep sources. The scoped M91 Carcano rifle that was found in the Book Depository "sniper's nest" was a caliber 6.5X52mm. Several investigators stated that the scope was wobbly and the reticles were misaligned. However those statements never made it into the media and the Warren Report. The 6.5 Carcano had a reputation of severe inaccuracy. This info supports the testimony of many experts that Oswald made an "impossible" shot from that distance on moving target. Ballistics determined, or so stated, that the bullet was from a box of Carcano rounds taken from Oswald's garage. Another Carcano, the Model 38 in caliber 7.35X51mm is, however, described by experts as extremely accurate. Several investigators interviewed over the years following the "official" release of the Warren Report, have stated that the shot was made by a 7.35x51 Carcano. This is still the current thinking due to interviews with retired CIA and aged Mafia members. This post could continue but is limited to Carcano discussion only because of the initial poster's question. I once owned both of these Carcano models at the same time. The quality difference was unmistakable. I regret never shooting them. Ammo was just too hard to locate for me at the time.
I recall hearing the same issues with the scope but that due to the height of the scope above the receiver, it was suggested that Oswald used the iron sights.
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top