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Guest
·What are some of the basics. I dont really involve myself in these threads but I have a hunch right now. Can anyone explain to me the "Basics"?
The Basic Tactics
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Guest
·They get to see your firearm when the bullets are coming out of the muzzle.
When the police arrive and you have a gun, they'll view you as a "tactical threat."
When dealing with the police after a shooting:
Request counsel of your attorney.
Shut the heck up.
You have the right to remain silent. You have the right to an attorney. If you tell the police anything besides that you want representation by your attorney, you're blathering and you need to stop.
When the police arrive and you have a gun, they'll view you as a "tactical threat."
When dealing with the police after a shooting:
Request counsel of your attorney.
Shut the heck up.
You have the right to remain silent. You have the right to an attorney. If you tell the police anything besides that you want representation by your attorney, you're blathering and you need to stop.
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3,633 Posts
In the unlikely situation you are complled to use deadly force, repeat after me....
The police are not my friends in this type of situation....
The police are not my friends in this type of situation....
I say this, not disrespect or make a negative indictment of the police. They are people just like you and I. Franky, their job sucks. They spend 85% of their time being lied to by people; what makes you think they will believe you right out of the chute? The cops expect you to lie. So DON"T! Do not exaggerate. Do not embellish anything you say to them. You will probably not remember what you are saying to them in 20 minutes when the adreniline and your nerves settle down. You have to be able to recount what happened clearly and succecently at least one hundred times later. I have family and friends in law enforcment. They all say the same thing. People trip themselves up because their story changes every time it is told. If you ever been a witness in court, that is why the attorney will ask you the same question fifteen different ways. If
you change anything, or what you are saying in court doesn't match the written statemen you gave the cops, the lawyer will be on you like a hungery coyote. So it is best to say as little as possible in the beginning.
After the shooting and cops roll up, PUT AWAY YOUR GUN.....FAST! Set it on the ground, on the hood of the car, anywhere but in your hand. Do everything the cops tell you to do without question. This will cap the situation somewhat. It will be hard, but you need to keep your presence of mind. Identify yourself as the victim and point out the badguy. If he had a weapon, definitly point that out to them. Are there any witnesses in the looky loos standing around? Point them out to the cops also.
In most of the cases, the cops will press you for a statement right then and now. DO NOT DO IT! You are only obligated to give them your name and address. This was told to me by a cop, remember it. "Officer, I am more than willing to cooperate with you, AFTER I speak with my attorney." Remember you will be all jacked up on adreneline, scared to death about what just happened, and definitly not able to think clearly.
Check your state and local laws concerning the use of deadly force. Does your state require retreat until cornered before bringing the gun into play? Do you have "under the cover of darkness" or castle doctrines? What are the laws concerning carrying a firearm in your vehicle? church?, eating places? If you don't know these answers, you better google up your state firearms laws and learn them cold.
The police are not my friends in this type of situation....
The police are not my friends in this type of situation....
I say this, not disrespect or make a negative indictment of the police. They are people just like you and I. Franky, their job sucks. They spend 85% of their time being lied to by people; what makes you think they will believe you right out of the chute? The cops expect you to lie. So DON"T! Do not exaggerate. Do not embellish anything you say to them. You will probably not remember what you are saying to them in 20 minutes when the adreniline and your nerves settle down. You have to be able to recount what happened clearly and succecently at least one hundred times later. I have family and friends in law enforcment. They all say the same thing. People trip themselves up because their story changes every time it is told. If you ever been a witness in court, that is why the attorney will ask you the same question fifteen different ways. If
you change anything, or what you are saying in court doesn't match the written statemen you gave the cops, the lawyer will be on you like a hungery coyote. So it is best to say as little as possible in the beginning.
After the shooting and cops roll up, PUT AWAY YOUR GUN.....FAST! Set it on the ground, on the hood of the car, anywhere but in your hand. Do everything the cops tell you to do without question. This will cap the situation somewhat. It will be hard, but you need to keep your presence of mind. Identify yourself as the victim and point out the badguy. If he had a weapon, definitly point that out to them. Are there any witnesses in the looky loos standing around? Point them out to the cops also.
In most of the cases, the cops will press you for a statement right then and now. DO NOT DO IT! You are only obligated to give them your name and address. This was told to me by a cop, remember it. "Officer, I am more than willing to cooperate with you, AFTER I speak with my attorney." Remember you will be all jacked up on adreneline, scared to death about what just happened, and definitly not able to think clearly.
Check your state and local laws concerning the use of deadly force. Does your state require retreat until cornered before bringing the gun into play? Do you have "under the cover of darkness" or castle doctrines? What are the laws concerning carrying a firearm in your vehicle? church?, eating places? If you don't know these answers, you better google up your state firearms laws and learn them cold.
G
Guest
·take a class. take a class. take a class. you will learn more in 10 min than you ever could on here.
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I have to disagree a little with not speaking to police until you see an attorney. These incidents generally happen at night and sometimes on weekends, your attorney might not be around when this happens (plus you would want to talk to a criminal defense attorney, not your estate lawyer about this). The police need to know what happened so that they can put together the evidence while they are on scene. This helps corroborate your version of events and helps them see the picture as it was unfolding to you...while they are on scene.
Imagine this: You are confronted by 3-4 violent street mutants with bats, knives or guns. You have to defend yourself and shoot one of them. He runs a little bit with his friends before collapsing and dies. His friends hide his weapon and all say you fired without provocation. On scene, the police have a dead man without any weapon and 3 people overly eager to blame you for the situation. When the police can look for the evidence of the disposed of weapon, other witnesses that can back you up, the blood spatter analysis from your angles, then you have a lot better chance of coming out of it than you are waiting till the next day or whenever after you talk to your lawyer. Then they go back to the scene and try to re-construct your version of the accounts long after the incident occured.
If I approach someone at a incident scene and ask them what happened, and they say "I want a lawyer", I assume that is my suspect until it can be shown clearly that he is not. No victim of crime anywhere does that. Police are used to victims and witnesses telling them what happened as soon as they arrive....not seeking legal counsel first. Remember John and Patsy Ramsey? When the police tried to get information from them about what happened to their daughter, they asked for attorneys...what does that tell you?
As a veteran LEO, I will tell you that it is a big help in determining the outcome of a situation when the investigators on scene can look at the evidence on scene from your point of view and work from there. Don't wait until you're indicted to tell them what happened.
Thats just an opinion from my point of view anyway, its all up to the shooter and what he feels comfortable doing. If it happens to me, I will tell them right then what happened.
Imagine this: You are confronted by 3-4 violent street mutants with bats, knives or guns. You have to defend yourself and shoot one of them. He runs a little bit with his friends before collapsing and dies. His friends hide his weapon and all say you fired without provocation. On scene, the police have a dead man without any weapon and 3 people overly eager to blame you for the situation. When the police can look for the evidence of the disposed of weapon, other witnesses that can back you up, the blood spatter analysis from your angles, then you have a lot better chance of coming out of it than you are waiting till the next day or whenever after you talk to your lawyer. Then they go back to the scene and try to re-construct your version of the accounts long after the incident occured.
If I approach someone at a incident scene and ask them what happened, and they say "I want a lawyer", I assume that is my suspect until it can be shown clearly that he is not. No victim of crime anywhere does that. Police are used to victims and witnesses telling them what happened as soon as they arrive....not seeking legal counsel first. Remember John and Patsy Ramsey? When the police tried to get information from them about what happened to their daughter, they asked for attorneys...what does that tell you?
As a veteran LEO, I will tell you that it is a big help in determining the outcome of a situation when the investigators on scene can look at the evidence on scene from your point of view and work from there. Don't wait until you're indicted to tell them what happened.
Thats just an opinion from my point of view anyway, its all up to the shooter and what he feels comfortable doing. If it happens to me, I will tell them right then what happened.
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leeindy said:
I agree with LeeIndy on this issue. Its wise to go to the experts and request that they share their knowledge with you. To learn from the master is to learn the true basics of gun handling, legal issues and responsibilities, and how to conduct yourself at the range or while carrying a firearm.
Basic gun handling can involve a lot of things. For example familiarization with your gun of choice, proper maintenance, sighting basics, trigger control, breathing techniques and much much more.
Rob P can jump in here and add paragraphs to my comments.
G
Guest
·DO NOW:
Purchase and read and re-read and read again:
"In The Gravest Extreme" by Massad Ayoob
And
"The Truth About Personal Protection" also by Massad Ayoob
Look into a pre-paid legal plan, which will provide you with an attorney 24 hrs a day 7 days a week. My plan costs about $15.00 per month.
Purchase and read and re-read and read again:
"In The Gravest Extreme" by Massad Ayoob
And
"The Truth About Personal Protection" also by Massad Ayoob
Look into a pre-paid legal plan, which will provide you with an attorney 24 hrs a day 7 days a week. My plan costs about $15.00 per month.
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179 Posts
I didn't think Pre-Paid legal handled "criminal" charges though.
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Guest
·Kudos to the OP for asking.
"The Basics" obviously means different things to different people.
Over the course of a couple months in the fall, I had the opportunity to work on a new TV Show, The Best Defense for Outdoor Channel. We wanted to focus on what we considered "the basics" during the first season. The first show aired last week and focused on home safety and the most fundamental parts of defensive shooting. We are also posting some articles online to support the infornation in the show. You can read the first one, regarding the fundamentals of defensive shooting, HERE: http://www.downrange.tv/bestdefense/article1-ep1.htm
If you get a chance to tune in on Wednesday evenings, you get more information about what we considered the important fundamentals.
-RJP
"The Basics" obviously means different things to different people.
Over the course of a couple months in the fall, I had the opportunity to work on a new TV Show, The Best Defense for Outdoor Channel. We wanted to focus on what we considered "the basics" during the first season. The first show aired last week and focused on home safety and the most fundamental parts of defensive shooting. We are also posting some articles online to support the infornation in the show. You can read the first one, regarding the fundamentals of defensive shooting, HERE: http://www.downrange.tv/bestdefense/article1-ep1.htm
If you get a chance to tune in on Wednesday evenings, you get more information about what we considered the important fundamentals.
-RJP
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6,002 Posts
SBH. Aren't you a prosecuting attorney?
Anyway good advise.
Also remember to not only train your mind, but your body. It is also a good idea to train your mind while you train your body.
Accuracy drops a lot when you are hopped up on adrenalin. So you HAVE to stress your body and your mind while you train on the range. This can happen many different ways. I like to go out and do some wind sprints, then go straight into the range and have my wife nagging me while I try to put rounds on target. You can also train your mind to remember facts by doing a Kim's game and then going and exercising, then finishing it when you get done with your run or whatever you choose to do for exercise. It will help greatly if you ever have to recall facts after defending yourself or your family.
Anyway good advise.
Also remember to not only train your mind, but your body. It is also a good idea to train your mind while you train your body.
Accuracy drops a lot when you are hopped up on adrenalin. So you HAVE to stress your body and your mind while you train on the range. This can happen many different ways. I like to go out and do some wind sprints, then go straight into the range and have my wife nagging me while I try to put rounds on target. You can also train your mind to remember facts by doing a Kim's game and then going and exercising, then finishing it when you get done with your run or whatever you choose to do for exercise. It will help greatly if you ever have to recall facts after defending yourself or your family.
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2,326 Posts
IF you are in a life threatening situation you will have an adrenalin rush the likes of which you have never experienced. That is not a good time to be talking.
My life was threatened.
I do not consent to a whole house search. ( if nothing occurred in your 'gun room' they will still want to take ALL of your guns. If not involved they are not evidence)
I will be happy to make a statement after I calm down and consult a lawyer. ( it is NOT true that consulting a lawyer is a sign of guilt. Life is NOT a tv show)
My life was threatened.
I do not consent to a whole house search. ( if nothing occurred in your 'gun room' they will still want to take ALL of your guns. If not involved they are not evidence)
I will be happy to make a statement after I calm down and consult a lawyer. ( it is NOT true that consulting a lawyer is a sign of guilt. Life is NOT a tv show)
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