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Ancient Gaseous Emanation
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KRISTINA WONG
30 Aug 2019


China’s worst nightmare may be happening: Mainland Chinese citizens are now participating in pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong, according to recent reports.

Wall Street Journal reported Wednesday that a “small cohort of mainlanders have joined the demonstrations, taking extraordinary risks to support a society that offers freedoms unavailable back home.”

“My understanding is that ‘one country, two systems’ is a creative set of ideals,” a 24-year-old Chinese graduate student living in Hong Kong with the last name Chen told the paper. “Now those ideals are threatened.”

The mainlanders said they value Hong Kong’s autonomy from Chinese control and have joined marches, signed open letters supporting Hong Kong, and defended the movement on social media.

Their participation is an indication that the movement could spread to mainland China, despite attempts by the government to brand the Hong Kong protesters as traitors.

Chinese authorities are reportedly checking travelers’ smartphones as they reenter China for evidence of participation in the demonstrations.

Another mainland Chinese citizen who took part in the protests has fled to Taiwan where he is hoping to stay, according to a report by Radio Free Asia.

Zhang Wen, 47, who is sleeping on the streets in Taipei after he abandoned a tour group he arrived with, told the outlet, “I definitely don’t want to go back to mainland China now … So I have two options: I can either apply to extend my visa here, or I can apply for political asylum.”

Zhang said he crossed into Hong Kong several times in June and July to take part in the protests. He reportedly has video of himself storming the Hong Kong Legislative Council building.

“The risk that I will be caught for my support for the anti-extradition protests is very high,” he told Radio Free Asia. “I will definitely get arrested for the storming of LegCo, because some people have been detained just for posting that they support the anti-extradition movement online.”

The protesters have been protesting the encroachment of Beijing on their freedoms following the United Kingdom’s handover of Hong Kong to China in 1997.

China and the United Kingdom signed a treaty in 1984 that agreed to a 50-year time period after the handover wherein Hong Kong would enjoy some political and social autonomy under a “one country, two systems” policy, ending in 2049.

However, since then, pro-democracy protesters in Hong Kong say they have faced an erosion of that autonomy by Beijing. In 2014, Hong Kong residents were forced to choose their next chief executive from a list of candidates vetted by Beijing, which sparked protests known as the Umbrella Movement.

The recent protests were sparked by a proposed bill that would allow those charged with crimes in Hong Kong to be extradited to the mainland where they could face harsher punishment under an opaque justice system.

The bill was tabled, but Hong Kong Chief Executive Carrie Lam has refused to withdraw it altogether, fueling continued protests throughout the summer that risk a violent crackdown by Chinese troops reminiscent of the brutal 1989 crackdown in Tiananmen Square.

Still, most mainlanders in Hong Kong share the Chinese government’s antipathy against the protesters, and some have even fought against the protesters, as the WSJ also reported.

The Chinese government have portrayed the protesters as violent extremists and have accused the U.S. of being behind the protests. Some protesters have carried the American flag as a symbol of freedom.




https://www.breitbart.com/national-...e-joining-pro-democracy-hong-kong-protesters/
 
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Ancient Gaseous Emanation
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AND


In short, there's evidence that amid that sea of millions of Hongkongers protesting communism from China, some of them are mainland Chinese. Message: the mainland Chinese are getting ideas. The Chicoms of Beijing cannot wall them out from Hong Kong nor can they stop this.

And this raises the specter of what happens when they return to China, because many of these Chinese have their families there, and they will. Are these Chinese going to return back to China and spread that democracy 'virus' they passionately embraced in Hong Kong, kicking off similar protests in Chengdu, Tianjin, Harbin, Shenzhen, Wuhan and other giant cities to duplicate what the Hongkongers launched? It actually seems plausible. What's more, it will be an awakening as Chinese finally come to the realization that they deserve the same freedoms their fellow Chinese in Hong Kong have enjoyed until recently. When ten or twelve Chinese megacities start holding the kinds of protests Hong Kong is holding, Bejing's old gray rulers will have a hell of a problem on their hands. And that is their worst, their very worst, nightmare.



https://www.americanthinker.com/blo...ng_is_now_appearing_on_their_own_horizon.html
 
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Aim true !
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The population is large. If enough want freedom. They can overthrow the current govt. The people there sure deserve a better life.
 

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Grand Imperial Poobah
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As much as Beijing wants this to end, the genie is out of the bottle. Tiananmen Square was a lost battle. Hong Kong may or may not be another lost battle. But someday, somehow the pro-democracy movement will have a win, and after that win, Beijing's days are numbered.
 

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I think the people of Hong Kong and mainland China will be getting some help from other countries.

Like the American revolution against Britain where France played a major role to the point that America may have lost, along with assist from Spain and the Netherlands, major players can slip help through the cracks and cause regime change without leaving a trace.
 

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When the Communist regime of China decides to do so, the demonstration will end and the result will be a large amount of dead people. What is holding the Communist leadership is the fact that the entire world is watching, but, once they decided to ignore the world, the crackdown will beguine.
 
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When the Communist regime of China decides to do so, the demonstration will end and the result will be a large amount of dead people. What is holding the Communist leadership is the fact that the entire world is watching, but, once they decided to ignore the world, the crackdown will beguine.


I agree but there is one difference between now and 1989. back then they hid much of what happened even though the world knew no one ever found out the death tolls, who was imprisoned etc. Now with cell phones and internet the world will know within seconds on what happened and most likely to a greater extent on what happens(if anything). Also i wonder if Trumps trade war right in the middle of this will have any affect? He could use it as leverage and impose huge sanctions and even bigger tariffs squeezing their economy even more if they were to pull a Tieniman square and massacre a bunch of people, the world would back Trump too......at least most of them.
 
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I agree but there is one difference between now and 1989. back then they hid much of what happened even though the world knew no one ever found out the death tolls, who was imprisoned etc. Now with cell phones and internet the world will know within seconds on what happened and most likely to a greater extent on what happens(if anything). Also i wonder if Trumps trade war right in the middle of this will have any affect? He could use it as leverage and impose huge sanctions and even bigger tariffs squeezing their economy even more if they were to pull a Tieniman square and massacre a bunch of people, the world would back Trump too......at least most of them.
Good comparison.

The Vietnam War was televised with embedded reporters and viewed in real time by the American public.

The protest movement got equal coverage and We the People forced the government to take corrective action.

In that regard, you are correct that China is under the microscope.

The Chinese people have way more freedom of movement now, and citizens can compare cultures. China relented in allowing individual entrepreneurship, which is anathema to the Communist dictatorial government, and China is growing a middle class for the first time.

Capitalism is a much stronger political party than any other on the planet. Along with that affluence comes the demand to be left alone to enjoy the benefits of increased wealth.

China as it is today is not sustainable. As the unwashed gain power, the government will come to appreciate its mistake in granting citizens freedoms in the marketplace.
 

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Good comparison.

The Vietnam War was televised with embedded reporters and viewed in real time by the American public.

The protest movement got equal coverage and We the People forced the government to take corrective action.

In that regard, you are correct that China is under the microscope.

The Chinese people have way more freedom of movement now, and citizens can compare cultures. China relented in allowing individual entrepreneurship, which is anathema to the Communist dictatorial government, and China is growing a middle class for the first time.

Capitalism is a much stronger political party than any other on the planet. Along with that affluence comes the demand to be left alone to enjoy the benefits of increased wealth.

China as it is today is not sustainable. As the unwashed gain power, the government will come to appreciate its mistake in granting citizens freedoms in the marketplace.


Yes but at the same time they also lost some freedoms since 1989 unless i remember wrong. I seem to remember them cracking down more on political dissent than even prior to that. Maybe things have eased up some over the years but either way like you said China is under the worlds watch right now and it just may make or break them politically and financially if played right or wrong.
 
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Yes but at the same time they also lost some freedoms since 1989 unless i remember wrong. I seem to remember them cracking down more on political dissent than even prior to that. Maybe things have eased up some over the years but either way like you said China is under the worlds watch right now and it just may make or break them politically and financially if played right or wrong.
I enjoy the discussion.

Adding to China's modernity is the Internet.

China is attempting to increase control over its citizens by way of censorship by blocking access to information via the Great Firewall. I swim in those waters and in my lectures, I point out that, "For every asshat who has a computer, there's another asshat who has a computer."

For every IT professional working for the Chinese government, statistics tell us that, because of the sheer numbers, civilians are far more likely to have superior computing skills.

This is true everywhere: You and I are using the same hardware/software technology as the military, governments and businesses across the planet.

That level playing field allows the Chinese people to circumvent the Firewall and to teach others how to do that. I'm reminded of "parental controls," that were supposed to protect children. Some smart kid would discover an unlock and spread the word.

China has turned a corner and there's no turning back.
 

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I enjoy the discussion.

Adding to China's modernity is the Internet.

China is attempting to increase control over its citizens by way of censorship by blocking access to information via the Great Firewall. I swim in those waters and in my lectures, I point out that, "For every asshat who has a computer, there's another asshat who has a computer."

For every IT professional working for the Chinese government, statistics tell us that, because of the sheer numbers, civilians are far more likely to have superior computing skills.

This is true everywhere: You and I are using the same hardware/software technology as the military, governments and businesses across the planet.

That level playing field allows the Chinese people to circumvent the Firewall and to teach others how to do that. I'm reminded of "parental controls," that were supposed to protect children. Some smart kid would discover an unlock and spread the word.

China has turned a corner and there's no turning back.
China restricting access to the internet is like the music/movie industry trying to stop piracy here. Every time they build a better mousetrap, someone comes up with a better mouse.
 
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You forget that their comrades at Google have helped them control their people's access to the Internet, inbound and outbound. They're not far off from North Korea when it comes to information.
It's not a mater of forgetting, it's a matter of acknowledging and dismissing.

International businesses adjust their products to conform with local laws. For instance, the EU has been crafting very stringent privacy laws that work to impede Google's business model of gathering and selling personal data to advertisers, companies, LEO and state governments both local and foreign to the point of sale.

Another example is Germany's law forbidding denial of the Holocaust. Google complies with that law by filtering and shaping search results.

China has its own set of laws as well. Google recognizes the great potential of presenting itself to billions of people and has made the (sometimes on, sometimes off) decision to build according to local law in China.

Google in China is a single example of what's become the norm for all other international companies: Each abide by local law.
 
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