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Right Wing Zealot
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1,228 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Joe Horn, the man who shot two burglars robbing his neighbors house this last year and was villified by the criminal left has been cleared of any criminal action by a Texas grand Jury...Hooray for our good citizens!
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,374223,00.html
 

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Texas Legal Gunslinger
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3,531 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

For now. I would imagine that some leftist DA will empanel another jury in a little while and try again. Much like Ronnie Earl did to Tom Delay.

I just hope our humble Harris County DA's will think twice about it.

But in the interim, one more small step towards justice for all.
 

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Texas Legal Gunslinger
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3,531 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

Of course, the above may just be me being a pessimist.
 

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Premium Member
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15,424 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

Thanks for that info, I was wondering what was going to happen to him. He will still need to watch his six for a while.
 

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Pro Gun Advocate
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10,940 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

I'm not certain how I feel about this.
 

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Right Wing Zealot
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1,228 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

Glock27Bill said:
I'm not certain how I feel about this.
Care to share with us friend?
 

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Pro Gun Advocate
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10,940 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

SatanzBountyHunter said:
Glock27Bill said:
I'm not certain how I feel about this.
Care to share with us friend?
Well, killing for property.

And the fact that he had 911 on the phone.

Personally, I would have gone for a camera (of course, would have been armed to protect my life).

I'm not necessarily saying that he should have been convicted, nor am I excusing the acts of the criminals, but having the cops on the phone while the crime is in progress then going outside and shooting them just doesn't sit right with me.
 

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Harley Dude
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14,651 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

I am glad he got off, but expect them to continue to try to hang him high.

He let his big mouth get him in a heap of trouble. Made statements that made him sound like a "Rambo" character. Not a smart move on his part.

If he would have just called the police reported the robbery and then tried to hold the robbers at bay he would have come out much better. To shoot folks in the back is not the action of a hero, unless they just killed a family member or one of your favorite dogs.
 

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Old School.
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11,011 Posts
Re: Joe Horn Cleared in Home Defense Shooting

Folks there one thing your missing I think is there was a under cover officer who seen it all go down and he said that the one scumbag ran at Mr Horn and that Mr Horn was on his own property. So really in Texas you do not have to retreat and you can protect your own property. Case closed. Would I have been that brave over some items in a house? No. :idea:
 

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Premium Member
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1,547 Posts
Was burglary worth killing 2 men?

CNN) -- Joe Horn may be praised by gun enthusiasts and thrill seekers as a no-nonsense guy who got fed up with crime in America by pulling out his shotgun and blasting two men to their deaths, but there is no doubt the Texas man will be haunted by his fatal decision.

Ever since the suburban Houston man saw two burglars crawling out his neighbor's window on November 14 and gunned them down, Horn has been in legal limbo, unsure if he was going to have to defend himself and his actions or go free.

Monday, a Harris County grand jury chose not to indict Horn in the deaths of Hernando Riascos Torres and Diego Ortiz, meaning he can live his life without having to explain before a jury of his peers why he chose to be judge, jury and executioner of the two.

As a native Texan, I know how folks in my state feel about criminals: Hit 'em hard, then hit 'em again. The state leads the nation in executions, and Texas juries don't play when it comes to crime.

Yet while folks revel in Horn's actions, it really does call for a moment of reflection about the seriousness of taking someone's life.

Horn did what any of us would do in that situation: He called 911 to report the crime, and was told officers were being dispatched. But he was so incensed with what was taking place he told the dispatcher he was going to kill the men. No amount of pleading could get him to stop. On the audiotape of the incident, we can hear Horn racking his gun, firing two shots and killing Torres and Ortiz.

"They had it coming." "Tough stuff." "They shouldn't have broken the law." I heard all of those comments and more on my radio show, blogs and other call-in shows, as a nation fed up with crime gave a big "Hooray!" for Horn.

But I just don't see exactly what there is to celebrate. Two men -- both illegal immigrants and one of them with a conviction for selling drugs -- are dead for stealing some personal effects, and we are supposed to welcome this vigilante justice? (I suppose it's ironic that one week after the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that the rape of a child doesn't merit the death penalty -- one that I disagree with -- many others are celebrating a man not standing trial for the killing of two others who committed robbery.)

Yes, the law was on Horn's side, whether he knew that or not when he fired. But when does our core decency come in when we make such life-altering decisions in a snap? Don't you think making the choice to kill someone should be based on something more dire, such as if your life is in danger?

Don't be so quick to jump up and down and say you would have done the same thing; really think about it and ask yourself if you would follow Joe Horn and kill two people for stealing from your neighbor.

At no point was Horn's life in danger. We also know that his neighbor was out of town and no one was at home. So don't try to bring up the various hypothetical situations that could alter the basic facts of the story.

Two sorry men who already broke the law by coming in the country illegally chose to hasten their fate by robbing the wrong house with the wrong neighbor watching.

Our choices have life-altering -- or life-ending -- consequences.

But Horn could have chosen differently. He didn't have to fire on the men. He could have heeded the advice of the dispatcher and not gone outside with his shotgun. He could have left apprehending criminals to the folks empowered to do so -- the police.

I think of my dad, who as a child I witnessed chase down two men who snatched a woman's Christmas gifts from her hand in a mall parking lot. If he had a gun, should he have just fired away, protecting this unknown woman's property?

I really want to know: Would you have pulled a Joe Horn and racked your shotgun and fired on the men if you were in his shoes?

Roland S. Martin is an award-winning journalist and CNN contributor. He is the author of "Listening to the Spirit Within: 50 Perspectives on Faith." Please visit his Web site at http://www.rolandsmartin.com/.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of the writer.





Now a couple questions.....

1. Was he justified?
2. Could you do this?
3. Hero or Killer?
 

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Registered
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957 Posts
Re: Was burglary worth killing 2 men?

I had to vote "Killer". I wish there was an in between 'killer' and 'just doing what's right'. I was taught from an early age that lethal force was only to defend life and limb. I dont know all the fact of the case, if the men were advancing on Horn, maybe he was justified. I am torn on this one, everybody is sick of crime, and the slimballs who commit crimes and are never brought to justice. One thing is certian, there are two less creeps breaking into homes in his neighborhood.
 

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Pro Gun Advocate
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10,940 Posts
But when does our core decency come in when we make such life-altering decisions in a snap? Don't you think making the choice to kill someone should be based on something more dire, such as if your life is in danger?
So where was this concern over kids being murdered for their shoes and their bling? Killing to protect property is nowhere near the level of evil of killing to TAKE property. When murder is committed during a robbery, society has failed the killers. When 2 illegal criminals are killed COMMITTING a robbery, he whines about the citizen.

WHile I've already stated that I am ambilivent about what happened, these 2 consistently broke the law, consistently put themselves in harm's way and lived a violent lifestyle...it caught up to them.

both illegal immigrants and one of them with a conviction for selling drug...
Where's the recognition that you and I are at risk because our immigration and justice systems are broken and fail honest citizens? Where is the author's discussion of the series of failures that led these three people to cross paths?

He falsely refers to this as vigelante justice (they were caught in the act, he didn't hunt them down), yet does not acnknowledge that this is the only justice that existed in this case.

(Dammit, I don't need to get fired up so early in the morning).
 

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Right Wing Zealot
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1,228 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
But Horn could have chosen differently. He didn't have to fire on the men. He could have left apprehending criminals to the folks empowered to do so -- the police.
You could make this argument about anything crime related..."he could have chose to wait for the police while they raped and murdered his wife"...so it doesn't fly with me. Criminals have control of the streets more and more, not police. The threat of being on probation and maybe going to jail doesn't scare street scum...but having their sh!t blown away does. If burglars thought they would get shot outright for breaking into people's homes...there would be a lot less burglary. Let the whiney author get his house thrashed a few times and he will be glad to have a neighbor like Joe Horn.
 

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Old School.
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11,011 Posts
Under Texas law Mr Horn is a free man period. Is he a hero, not in my book. He just did what he thought was right. Should he be brought up on more charges, No. Would I have done things different, yes. I am not going to keep trying to second guess Mr Horn and what he should have done. Fire fights happen fast and people get shot in the back in them, it happens for any number of reasons. Now Mr Horn will have to carry the emotinal baggage of what happen for the rest of his life and that might not be easy. Do I feel for the Scumbags, No Way. They chose a life of crime and now it's over.
 

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Harley Dude
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14,651 Posts
I was not there so it is very difficult to make a valid judgement about Mr. Horns safety and whether he reacted correctly or not.

I too have a problem with illegal immigration and criminals feeling free to take what they want. I would have tried to stop them but most likely not fired at them unless..........they tried to attack me or my family. I don;t think I would have chosen to have blood on my hands unless my life was in danger. If I was my home then I would not be very nice.

I really can't say for sure how I would have reacted in similar circumstances. :eek:

But I did vote with the 80% of members who claimed he just did what he had to do. That was a bit of an integrity issue, with Mr Horn, that he felt strongly about and decided to enforce. Thou Shall Not Steal Thy Neighbors Property!!

Old school Americans are wired differently and feel stronger about crime than do many of us who are conditioned to it being a bigger part of society.
 

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Registered
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Certainly not a hero, but I don't believe he's a cold-blooded killer, either.

At best, he showed poor judgment, not to mention poor tactics, by going outside. I believe that once he was outside that the perps did in fact come at him, and he had no choice but to fire on them. However, had he not gone out there, he would never have been in any danger.
 

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Pro Gun Advocate
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10,940 Posts
I'm curious as to what testimony was provided.

Especially regarding the officer who was said to be nearby.
 
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