National Gun Forum banner
1 - 8 of 8 Posts

·
Boolit Master
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Ever since the 165 gr. 30 XCB bullet came out several years ago I always wanted one for my 30 cal. rifles especially my 30-06 an 300 Sav. It's been a great cast bullet accuracy wise an for longer range shooting as well as a hunting bullet but the initial run of molds were scooped up before I could purchase one and the recent group buy over on Cast Boolits I didn't find out about till it was closed. I know Al always has some overuns so I kept a close watch on his site an sure enough they came up for sale so I ordered one back during the 4th. I've waited about two years to get one.

I ended up buying the 3 cavity gas check version for the price of a two cavity and threw in a top punch as well for my RCBS lube sizer if I want to use it at some point, I mostly shoot powder coated bullets in rifles and handguns but I always test both with identical loads and shoot whats the most accurate. My plan was to use H-4198 to start with an see if I can hit the 2300 fps. velocity range in my 30-06 and see if the accuracy held up at that velocity, there are lots of powders to work with in the slower burn range and alloy combinations to get some excellent results.




I initially cast up about 150 of the 30 XCB bullets, I only had a limited time that day to work with them so I just coated about ten each using Super Durable Clear and Popping Silver Vein gas checked and sized them to see how they would turn out. I cast a random set of samples during the casting process and after they cooled I measure and weighed each set. The bullets across the sampling weighed between 167.0 and 167.3 grs. Two bullets from the mold using my micrometer measured .311" while the third bullet measured .311.5" The powder coating added around .002" to the diameter before sizing and the final sizing was .309" I would have preferred to size larger but the chamber on my Remington is very tight so .309" worked out great.

I finally got out to the back yard range at my buddies house to do some initial testing a while back, I tried several differ powders in mid range and upper mid range loads and they all pretty much shot the same but the H-4198 load gave the best velocity and groups. I ended up settling on a load of 35.0 grs. of H-4198 as my go to load as it shot well at 50 yds. which is a far as I can shoot without driving to a public range which is basically a day trip.



Coated up a few more bullets last weekend. This time I coated one set of bullets with the gas check installed to see if the copper check would take the powder which it did and the second reason is to see if the coated gas check shoot any different with an identical load with the check installed after coating. Some coatings are thicker making installing gas check a bit harder so if the coated check bullet shoot just as well I'll install the gas check before coating. While I was at it I tried a few of my favorite colors on the 30 XCB just to take up some space on the baking tray.


 

·
Registered
Joined
·
541 Posts
35 grs of H4198 is pretty hot for cast bullets. It's roughly twice the recommended volume for H4198 with 150-180 grs cast bullets in C.E. Harris' "Cast Loads for Military Surplus Rifles" in "Mattern's 200 yard target load". But can't really argue with results like the group above!

If you are unfamiliar with Harris' article, it's a great read:

Cast Bullet Loads for Military Rifles - Article
 

·
Boolit Master
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
35 grs of H4198 is pretty hot for cast bullets. It's roughly twice the recommended volume for H4198 with 150-180 grs cast bullets in C.E. Harris' "Cast Loads for Military Surplus Rifles" in "Mattern's 200 yard target load". But can't really argue with results like the group above!

If you are unfamiliar with Harris' article, it's a great read:

Cast Bullet Loads for Military Rifles - Article
I'm familiar with Mr. Harris's work and have communicated with him a few time over on the CBA Forum. I shoot the 16.0 gr. load of 2400 in several rifle cartridges and it has always product excellent results in any of the rifle calibers mentioned in the article, I use 2400 in my 7.62 x 39 cast loads in my SKS rifles as well.

As to the 4198 load data in the article it's just for duplicating the ballistics of the 16.0 grs. of 2400 an not a set number by any means, the load data I used with 4198 if from the Lyman #4 Cast Bullet Manual and I'm not at a MAX load either and there is room to go but I'm happy with where I'm at.

I didn't mention that the alloy I use is 50/50 pure lead / wheel weights with a bit of tin added. After the bullets are powder coated and cured I water quench, then size and let them sit for about two weeks it's usually longer to age harden. They get up to around 15 BHN with my old wheel weight alloy. I put about fifty rounds of the 35.0 gr. 4198 loads down the tube during testing and the bore was nice and shiny with no trace of leading. One wet patch and a couple dry patch just to remove any powder residue was all that was needed.

Some Chrono data for the 35.0 gr. H-4198 test load.

Rifle - Remington 770 24" barrel 1:10 Twist
Brass - Remington 30-06
Primer - CCI LR
Bullet - NOE 30 XCB 170 gr. 50/50 PB / WW + Tin, gas checked, powder coated, WQ'ed

Low: 2277
High: 2309
Average: 2292
Spread: 31.71
SD: 15.39
 

·
Boolit Master
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Cool i run these loaded with 13 grains of red dot. Im on cast boolets too. But it's hard to keep up there lol.
https://www.snscasting.com/30-30-158-grain-round-nose-flat-point-red-coated-250ct/
I need to try some of the 13 gr. Red Dot loads just never have gotten around to it. I do use Red Dot quiet a bit in my 30-30 plinker loads with 150 to 170 gr. cast bullets, around 7.0 grs. get me just over 1200 fps. with those weight bullets an I can leave the gas check off as well as it's really not needed at those pressures and velocities. In my old Sav. 170 pump 30-30 it's as accurate as you can hold it.

I know what you mean about trying to keep up over there, you can spend a day an still not have read all the new post.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14,912 Posts
Nice looking group! Never seen anyone coat over the gas check before but i know what you mean about getting them on over the coating. I usually tap them on with a plastic hammer with the nose on a wooden bench if i get any that don't want to just pop on.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
541 Posts
Impressive! I've never gotten into the PC thing. But, as I said, can't argue with the results of that group!
 

·
Boolit Master
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
Impressive! I've never gotten into the PC thing. But, as I said, can't argue with the results of that group!
I've lubed bullets about every way you can, I started in my mid 20s pan lubing all my pistol bullets I wasn't into casting or shoot cast lead in rifle as all I had them was a Sav. 340 in 22 Hornet. Later on I switched to Lee Alox and dealt with that sticky mess for many years, you have to remember back then nobody around me reloaded or cast their own bullets so I had to teach myself everything through trial an error using my reloading and casting manuals an magazine articles as there was no internet or forums at that time.

Many years later I learn how to make the recluse lube using the Lee Alox or Xlox sold by Glenn at White Label Lubes that you mix with reduced down Johnson Paste Wax an mineral spirits. I used that with great results for a number of years till I picked up an old first generation RCBS Lube A Matic with ten different sizers for $80,eight of the sizers I could use right off the bat. The Lube A Matic needed a few parts an RCBS shipped everything I needed to me free of charge even though I told them I had bought it second handed, just can't beat there customer service.

I still use my lube sizer with some bullets I cast especially if I'm going to load and shoot them fairly soon, I store my bullets out in my shop and it not heated or cooled so lubed bullets don't fair to well in the extreme conditions. Thats one reason I started powder coating, I can coat up several hundred in an hour or two and they handle the elements just fine and are ready to load and shoot whenever I need them plus there is no smoke and they leave my barrel nice and shiny. I never had a problem with leading in my rifles and handguns so powder coating never had to solve that problem.

Here are some Lee .312" 185 gr. RN bullets I coated in Copper Vain PC, I shoot these in my SKS and Mosin Rifles.


Same bullet in Carolina Blue with Aluminum gas checks.
 
1 - 8 of 8 Posts
Top