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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
x-posted for more information

Cimarron 1874 Sporting Rifle Sharps falling block .45-70. Brand new, received last week or so, first range session today. o_O

Load round 1, fire, eject. Load round 2. Lever won't close, block rises slightly, hangs on the rim, cartridge chambered. Pulled the lever pin and lever, block still hangs on the rim. I removed the fore end and further inspection shows the barrel is loose! As in perhaps an 1/8th of an inch in both directions :sick: of the witness mark. Finally tapped the round out of the chamber with cleaning rod. Later on at home, rinse and repeat. The barrel is clearly so loose it's preventing the action from closing on a chambered round. Thus making the rifle a TRUE single shot. I only got 1 round off before it stopped functioning.

I'll have to send it off, but just for my information, please: Does anybody know how the barrel is secured in the receiver? It doesn't appear to be threaded, pinned perhaps? If pinned, would that first round have caused the loosening?

Also looks like I'll have to prepay shipping back to Cimarron after getting authorization, and expect a minimum 2 month wait. So much for a preprinted shipping label, although to be fair, I don't know that yet. I'll call Customer Service tomorrow. Email sent tonight


-jb
 

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The Cimarron 1874 Sporting Rifle Sharps falling block .45-70 is made by Pedersoli and features a barrel threaded at the receiver.

 

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my understanding is that they are threaded.........
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Popeye, deputy ...
Thanks. That's becoming the answer. I'm coming across similar answers as to the appropriate fix, shimming, thread cutting back. I guess I wait for Cimarron return authorization, and a couple of months of evaluation. BUT ... at the moment it's speculation, and I'll reply with the resolution on-going.

-jb, objectivity at the moment
 

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I have had one of the 1874 Pedersoli Cimarron rifles since 2003-04 I can't remember when I bought it. At that time the were listed as "Quigley", the barrel is threaded. I have been told there was a bit of a court battle over the name, but never a hint of problems with the rifle it's self. Mine has always shot like a champ, after I slugged the bore discovering the true diameter .459". Some of the 'Experimental' loads I ran through it would have revealed any poor machine work of bad metallurgy.

Cimarron has always been a bear about quality control. I don't believe I would want to be the recipient of the call at Pedersoli when Cimarron gets your rifle. I hope you made pictures of the offending parts.
120107
GUNS TARGETS PEDERSOLI CIMARRON QUIGLEY #5 .JPG
 

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Man that is a bummer but i'm sort of confused why the action wouldn't close. It the barrel was loose i would think it would move the chamber away from the block causing more head space and a sloppy action rather than towards the block causing a action that is too tight to prevent closing. Also if it were an 1/8" turned i would think the first you notice is the sights moved.
 

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Popeye, deputy ...
Thanks. That's becoming the answer. I'm coming across similar answers as to the appropriate fix, shimming, thread cutting back. I guess I wait for Cimarron return authorization, and a couple of months of evaluation. BUT ... at the moment it's speculation, and I'll reply with the resolution on-going.

-jb, objectivity at the moment
Please do yourself a favor. DO NOT make any repairs to the rife. If you alter the mechanism in any way Pedersoli and Cimarron Arms will forget to know you. They are both first rate companies and will do the "Right thing" with regard to the unaltered rifle. I have owned several Pedersoli firearms over the years. I have never had a problem with any of them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Sorry for the delay. Not trying to revive the thread, just adding information. Specifically Square target asked:
Man that is a bummer but i'm sort of confused why the action wouldn't close. It the barrel was loose i would think it would move the chamber away from the block causing more head space and a sloppy action rather than towards the block causing a action that is too tight to prevent closing. Also if it were an 1/8" turned i would think the first you notice is the sights moved.
While I was waiting for a Cimarron response, I queried elsewhere about exactly that, got some suggestions and applied them. Best I can recreate is the following: 1st round chambered and fired perfectly. Drop the lever and block and the barrel loosened. Chamber the next round and it seems closing the action on the loose barrel causes the ejector to now interfere with the block closing. After the event I scrutinized the issue. When the action closes on an empty chamber there is no cartridge rim to slip in front of the extractor so the action closed and puts enough pressure on the barrel to keep it tight in place. Open the action the barrel pressure is relieved and the barrel loosens. That's apparently why the action won't close on a loaded chamber, and why the loaded round won't extract from the chamber.

That's a pretty circular explanation, but best I can describe. Does that make sense? As to the sight ... 1st round was fired at a 3 foot square target. Complete miss. I'm no Olympic marksman, but I'm a little better that 36" off :cautious:
And, to their credit so far, after I objected about having to pay shipping for a basically NIB defect, Cimarron sent a shipping label and it shipped via UPS Dec. 23rd to what looks to be a 1 man authorized gunsmith in Bryan Texas. I'll update again as this moves along.

-jb
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Northtidesix, no, I wouldn't ever attempt repairs myself. As an aside, I don't quite know all the affiliations of the manufacturers, but the rifle is marked as manufactured by Chiappa, not Pedersoli. Certainly Cimarron is the importer of several Italian manufacturers.

-jb
 

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1st round was fired at a 3 foot square target. Complete miss.

-jb
I assure you i'm much taller than 3' but still glad you missed! :D

The extractor interfering makes perfect sense now that i think about how my sharps works.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
^^^^
Now folks, that right there was funny :ROFLMAO:

-jb, coming out of retirement to do stand-up comedy
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
[Reviving the thread for promised update]

You can’t make this stuff up …

I had a message today to call Cimarron Firearms about my gun [yay, fingers crossed]

I called back and spoke to the Texas Customer Service Rep. She’s happy as a clam, explains that the gunsmith had to send my gun back to the Chiappa factory in Ohio. But they got it repaired, sent it back to the Texas Customer Service center, and she’s going to get it boxed up and sent out to me tomorrow. She goes on to explain it doesn’t have to go to an FFL, (I knew that), verified my address, blah blah blah. As we were finishing up I asked her what repair was made.

“Let’s see,” she says … sound of papers shuffling. “Oh, it says they modified the trigger plate [can almost see the smile on her face].” I nicely explained that I don’t even know what a trigger plate is, but my issue didn’t seem to have anything to do with a trigger plate. She asked me what gun I sent (uh-oh). I told her the model and type of the rifle, and the issue was a loose barrel.

She’s properly embarrassed and explains she thought I was a different customer. She found the paperwork on mine and confirmed the gunsmith had noted “the barrel can be unscrewed by hand” and sent it also to the factory in Ohio.

Me: so my rifle is not repaired?
Her: no, sorry
Me: and you’re not boxing up and sending me the gun?
Her: no, sorry
Me: I had you calendared to follow up on Friday, since that would be 30 business days since the gunsmith received it. Since you called me, could you check on the progress and get me an update?
Her: yes sir. I’ll do that and let you know. I’ll email you tomorrow. I’m sorry for the confusion.
[Conversation closes]

[Jeff kicks himself in the back] Daaaang. If I’d have kept my mouth shut, I might have had some weapon with a “modified trigger plate: show up!” Wait what? Heck, some guy in Sheboygan NJ might still end up with a once fired falling block :eek: Talk about confidence in a company … Well, at least they're responsive, friendly, and trying to be helpful

You can’t make this stuff up …

-jb, patiently awaiting the next adventure
 
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So out of the blue today, I received a falling block rifle! A sharps in 45/70. It’s like it’s my birthday or something.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
That's just some old rifle. Check the washer on the barrel.
Tomorrow I expect delivery of a shiny new Jennings .22 with a modified trigger plate

nyah nyah

-jb, not believing. at the moment
 
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[Reviving the thread for promised update]

You can’t make this stuff up …

I had a message today to call Cimarron Firearms about my gun [yay, fingers crossed]

I called back and spoke to the Texas Customer Service Rep. She’s happy as a clam, explains that the gunsmith had to send my gun back to the Chiappa factory in Ohio. But they got it repaired, sent it back to the Texas Customer Service center, and she’s going to get it boxed up and sent out to me tomorrow. She goes on to explain it doesn’t have to go to an FFL, (I knew that), verified my address, blah blah blah. As we were finishing up I asked her what repair was made.

“Let’s see,” she says … sound of papers shuffling. “Oh, it says they modified the trigger plate [can almost see the smile on her face].” I nicely explained that I don’t even know what a trigger plate is, but my issue didn’t seem to have anything to do with a trigger plate. She asked me what gun I sent (uh-oh). I told her the model and type of the rifle, and the issue was a loose barrel.

She’s properly embarrassed and explains she thought I was a different customer. She found the paperwork on mine and confirmed the gunsmith had noted “the barrel can be unscrewed by hand” and sent it also to the factory in Ohio.

Me: so my rifle is not repaired?
Her: no, sorry
Me: and you’re not boxing up and sending me the gun?
Her: no, sorry
Me: I had you calendared to follow up on Friday, since that would be 30 business days since the gunsmith received it. Since you called me, could you check on the progress and get me an update?
Her: yes sir. I’ll do that and let you know. I’ll email you tomorrow. I’m sorry for the confusion.
[Conversation closes]

[Jeff kicks himself in the back] Daaaang. If I’d have kept my mouth shut, I might have had some weapon with a “modified trigger plate: show up!” Wait what? Heck, some guy in Sheboygan NJ might still end up with a once fired falling block :eek: Talk about confidence in a company … Well, at least they're responsive, friendly, and trying to be helpful

You can’t make this stuff up …

-jb, patiently awaiting the next adventure
I apologize for my earlier MISLEADING comments about CIMARRON ARMS. I had very good customer relations with those folks for years. Apparently their customer service has gone in the tank in recent years. I will never recommend them again. I appears they have followed the path of Sears & Roebuck.... going down the tube ONE CUSTOMER AT A TIME. It won't be long until they are show casing Jennings, and Lorcin 9mm semi auto's. SAD.
Roy
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Nah, I'm not saying that. Truth be told, I thought it was pretty hilarious. I guess "you had to be there." I'm just happy I had the forethought to ask what the repair had been. Otherwise the nice Customer Service lady might have made a pretty bad mistake. Can you imagine being happy your repaired gun was on the way, only to get someone else's?!? Probably would have been worse for her than me.

I'm mostly a bit crankier than that. But WTH, it's still winter here, not much I could be doing with my rifle besides fondling it anyway. 'Sides ... I don't think your comments were misleading. If you had a good experience that's your experience. And, actually, so far I'm really not having a BAD experience. Time will tell, and I anticipate another follow up post with the final disposition.

-jb, not believing I'm so calm :whistle:
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
x-posted per usual

Saga continues ...
Anybody have a valid email address for some exec at Cimarron Arms? Best I could find was a possible [email protected] dunno if that's valid or not.

-jb, getting no replies
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
sorry to reply to my own post, but I think I'm closing this thread out. No resolution, no information. I received a response on another forum and I generated this probable final post:

[responding poster], I have indeed documented everything.

Update: Back to the post when the nice lady said my rifle had been forwarded to the "factory in Ohio." I emailed Chiappa Ohio and their reply was that they did not have my rifle, Cimarron has not sent it to them
AYKM??
So, since that Feb 8th conversation, I've followed with more emails. [crickets] For some reason they are no longer even responding. I called the original CSR's numbers ... no answer, no answering machine, just ring ring ring until I gave up. Right now I know zero about their repairs. All I know is their customer service has provided conflicting and false information and for whatever reason stopped answering my inquires. That's about the worst thing you can do, ignore a customer.

[Responding poster]: "next time you talk to any one there, tell them you have kept all e-mails and phone calls from day one and if things don,t get resolved to your liking, you will post every thing"

Yeah, I've considered that. Just not my style. Sounds like "I'm gonna tell my mom on you ..." No offense, I just don't play that card. Besides, everything I've posted here and elsewhere is factual and not embellished. I leave it up to the readers to draw their conclusions.

So to recap: It's been well over 60 days. Their CSR offered to follow up if I asked, has not. Another CSR almost (apparently) returned the wrong gun, and again offered to provide an update, didn't happen. I was told the rifle was returned to the factory, factory denies. Additional requests to original CSR and company president (if I had the correct e-dress) are unanswered. I'm inquiring about a credit card merchant dispute, but I'm guessing it's too late. I almost feel like my gun is lost, but I can't be sure one way or another.

Conclusion: take what you will about Cimarron customer care. But thanks again for the suggestion

-jb, never never land
 

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Jeff,
One letter from an attorney on his stationary directed to the head person at Cimarron will get more activity in a very short period of time and most probably get you your repaired rifle back to you. I know this is a "last resort" but it sounds very much like you are willing to just give up. I can see that if you stole the rifle if not you deserve much better treatment than you have gotten. It's not a big deal for an attorney to write a letter, it doesn't have to be threatening and it shouldn't be expensive, but it should get results.

Mike
 
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