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Ancient Gaseous Emanation
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
JOHN SEXTON
Sep 09, 2022


CBS News has a big scoop this afternoon. The industry group that sets international standards for credit card companies has decided to create a new code for the purchase of guns and ammo that, while not identifying the exact purchases, will separate those items from the more generic category they had been lumped in with previously.
Merchant category codes are made up of four digits and are used across all sorts of industries as a means to classify retailers, while not revealing individual product purchases. Credit card companies currently lump firearm retailers in with other outlets, classifying them as either “5999: Miscellaneous retail stores” or “5941: Sporting Goods Stores.”
With a new code for firearms merchants, potentially suspicious purchasing patterns could be flagged to law enforcement — much the same way banks and credit unions made more than 1.4 million suspicious activity reports in 2021 for other types of transactions that might suggest anything from identity theft to terrorist financing.
This is part of a plan being pushed by congressional Democrats after Amalgamated Bank of New York, a progressive bank that often involves itself in social issues, made repeated attempts to push for the new code, all of which were denied.
A group of congressional Democrats is urging credit card companies to track suspect firearm and ammunition purchases as a means to identify and stop gun crime, according to a letter obtained by CBS News Thursday.
The letter, drafted by Sen. Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts and Rep. Madeleine Dean of Pennsylvania and signed by over a dozen of their colleagues, urges the CEOs of Mastercard, American Express and Visa to back the creation of a merchant category code for gun and ammunition retailers — a measure the industry had initially resisted, according to an investigation by CBS News in June.
“The creation of a new [merchant category code] for gun and ammunition retail stores would be the first step towards facilitating the collection of valuable financial data that could help law enforcement in countering the financing of terrorism efforts,” the letter says.
So it looks like the congressional pressure worked. The new code has been approved but it sounds like Visa is not happy about it even as the CEO of Amalgamated Bank is celebrating.
In a letter obtained by CBS News, sent by Visa on Wednesday in response to congressional Democrats who supported the plan, the company said, “We believe that asking payment networks to serve as a moral authority by deciding which legal goods can or cannot be purchased sets a dangerous precedent.”
Visa wrote, “We understood Amalgamated Bank’s request to be justified, at least in part, by an interest in blocking transactions that would fall under such a new category, and Visa’s rules expressly prohibit blocking of legal transactions under an MCC.”…
“We all have to do our part to stop gun violence,” said Priscilla Sims Brown, President and CEO of Amalgamated Bank. “And it sometimes starts with illegal purchases of guns and ammunition. The new code will allow us to fully comply with our duty to report suspicious activity and illegal gun sales to authorities without blocking or impeding legal gun sales. This action answers the call of millions of Americans who want safety from gun violence and we are proud to have led the broad coalition of advocates, shareholders, and elected officials that achieved this historic outcome.”
Priscilla Sims Brown recently appeared on CNBC where she was asked about her effort to push the new category code for guns. “If we did have a merchant code for gun stores we could detect patterns that would indicate that there had been something unusual going on,” Brown said. She says all the banks will do is file a suspicious activity report at which point it would be up to local or federal law enforcement to act on those reports (she wasn’t very clear about who would be doing the follow up).


If that’s so, why is Visa concerned about attempts to block transactions using these codes? I just checked and so far Elizabeth Warren hasn’t posted any tweets celebrating this outcome. She’ll probably get around to it this weekend.



 

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Ancient Gaseous Emanation
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
In a letter obtained by CBS News, sent by Visa on Wednesday in response to congressional Democrats who supported the plan, the company said, “We believe that asking payment networks to serve as a moral authority by deciding which legal goods can or cannot be purchased sets a dangerous precedent.”

Visa wrote, “We understood Amalgamated Bank’s request to be justified, at least in part, by an interest in blocking transactions that would fall under such a new category, and Visa’s rules expressly prohibit blocking of legal transactions under an MCC.”…
 

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In a letter obtained by CBS News, sent by Visa on Wednesday in response to congressional Democrats who supported the plan, the company said, “We believe that asking payment networks to serve as a moral authority by deciding which legal goods can or cannot be purchased sets a dangerous precedent.”

Visa wrote, “We understood Amalgamated Bank’s request to be justified, at least in part, by an interest in blocking transactions that would fall under such a new category, and Visa’s rules expressly prohibit blocking of legal transactions under an MCC.”…
from their ‘oh so tough’ rhetoric in the letter…. Visa will cave, once political pressure is applied.
 

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Cash is not an option when buying online… which I do frequently…

I use a credit card to protect myself from non-delivery or quality issues from the seller

i don’t buy from online sellers that charge for using a credit card

I’ll keep using my USAA Visa card for all online gun purchases and if they ever try and stop a purchase… I’ll cancel that USAA card and switch to using my local credit union‘s Mastercard

i pay the balance off each month so I pay no credit card interest

Btw- they can track me with electronic purchases or just read this forum to see what I buy ;)
 

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"The industry group that sets international standards for credit card companies has decided to create a new code for the purchase of guns and ammo"
Or
a new merchant code from the International Organization for Standardization.
Previously, individual sales from gun stores were categorized as “general merchandise.”

International Organization Approves Special Code That Will Monitor Gun Store Transactions
A subcommittee of the International Organization for Standardization (ISO) has approved a special code which would monitor transactions at gun retailers, a representative said Friday, Reuters reports.

ISO is a non-governmental organization founded in 1946 with 167 national standards bodies in membership. The organization “brings together experts to share knowledge and develop voluntary, consensus-based market relevant International Standards that support innovation and provide solutions to global challenges,” according to its website.

Amalgamated Bank has helped lead the effort to create the merchant code, the New York Times reports. The Daily Caller News Foundation was able to confirm the Reuters report Saturday.

“A meeting was held on the 7 of September 2022 to Review Amalgamated Bank’s MCC application,” ISO said in a statement provided to the DCNF. (RELATED: ANALYSIS: After SCOTUS Blow, Anti-Gun States Are Getting Desperate…And A Little Racist)

“Considering the application met all the criteria from ISO 18245 and no material arguments pertaining to the approval criteria outlined in the ISO 18245 standard to reject the code were made, SC9 leadership has approved this MCC application in order to comply with the standard.”
Several prominent Democrats have applauded the move.



What is the ISO?
ISO (International Organization for Standardization) is a worldwide federation of national standards bodies.

ISO is a nongovernmental organization that comprises standards bodies from more than 160 countries, with one standards body representing each member country. For example, the American National Standards Institute represents the United States.

ISO members are national standards organizations that collaborate in the development and promotion of international standards for technology, scientific testing processes, working conditions, societal issues and more. ISO and its members then sell documents detailing these standards.

The ISO's General Assembly is its decision-making body. It consists of representatives from the members and elected leaders called principal officers. The organization has its headquarters in Geneva, Switzerland, where a central secretariat oversees operations.


The Amalgamated Bank Give-Back Checking Account is a solid interest-earning checking account with zero monthly service fees. This account stands out from other checking accounts because Amalgamated Bank matches the equivalent of half the interest you earn on the account and lets you donate that amount to a charity partnered with the institution.

You'll be able to donate to one of the following progressive organizations:


I read this as similar to the silicon valley / .com collusion with the biden administration.
They found a big bank to carry there water to an international organization.
An end around play.
 

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Jesus Saves
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Cash is not an option when buying online… which I do frequently…

I use a credit card to protect myself from non-delivery or quality issues from the seller

i don’t buy from online sellers that charge for using a credit card

I’ll keep using my USAA Visa card for all online gun purchases and if they ever try and stop a purchase… I’ll cancel that USAA card and switch to using my local credit union‘s Mastercard

i pay the balance off each month so I pay no credit card interest

Btw- they can track me with electronic purchases or just read this forum to see what I buy ;)
I'n not worried about them cancelling or denying a sale but rather have it on record for the ATF, FBI and others have a record on my personal business.
 

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Government is not allowed to keep a database of gun buyers and purchases so they are contracting it out to corporations. It becomes a registry. Then, if government wants to see it, it's a small step in that direction.

Of course, ammo and gear purchases are also included so if you buy ammo, it's easy to assume you have a gun in that caliber. Or if you buy a holster for a P226, also safe to assume you have a P226. Etc. etc. ad nauseum.

--Wag--
 

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I wonder if the Visa debt cards are included.
Yes from what I understand. Unless you hit an ATM and then use cash. I wonder how many gun shops will now be installing ATM machines?
 

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I'n not worried about them cancelling or denying a sale but rather have it on record for the ATF, FBI and others have a record on my personal business.
Understood. Although, I believe they (ATF and FBI and other ’letter’ agencies) already have a record / files of our personal business.

however, I agree this step makes it easier for them to gather information and target us.

i wonder if I stopped using my Visa and moved exclusively to using my MasterCard from my local credit union if that would make a difference? Or… is something stupid going on like Visa is the processing agent for all MasterCard transactions anyway? Who knows…

we need an alternative financial infrastructure that patriots can use without surveillance risk
 

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Visa and MasterCard are virtually the same. Even though they are two different companies, they operate within the same boundaries on the same playing field. Assume that how Visa plays, so does Mastercard and vice-versa.

So far, I haven't heard any different for this code.

--Wag--
 

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This sounds a lot like a dog chasing it's own tail. None of these registry systems works, and after a few months, or years, and millions spent, they are abandoned, for being top-heavy, and useless.

Push the cart downhill. We should all go out, buy a few guns with credit cards, then privately sell them.
 

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Grand Imperial Poobah
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I have to think that anyone withdrawing several hundred dollars from this particular ATM would be also added to that pseudo registry.

AND I don't know if it is the same for all banks, but my bank has a daily ATM withdraw limit of $500. Since most firearms that I am interested in are priced above that $500 limit, having an ATM in a gun store wouldn't be beneficial for me.
 
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I have to think that anyone withdrawing several hundred dollars from this particular ATM would be also added to that pseudo registry.

AND I don't know if it is the same for all banks, but my bank has a daily ATM withdraw limit of $500. Since most firearms that I am interested in are priced above that $500 limit, having an ATM in a gun store wouldn't be beneficial for me.
Mine is $500 as well but I can change it if I want. Some banks go as high as 3k per day for ATM withdrawls. Most people I talk to seem to have it set around 1k.
 
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